Betsy DeVos鈥� tenure as the nation鈥檚 11th secretary of education will come to an end in January. Her time in office has been turbulent, from a contentious Senate confirmation through the extraordinary challenges posed by a once-a-century pandemic. As she approaches the end of her tenure, Secretary DeVos agreed to share some thoughts on her experiences, what she learned in office, and what advice she鈥檇 offer her successor. Here鈥檚 what she had to say.
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Rick: Back in 2017, your confirmation process was remarkably contentious. Looking back, what did you take from that and how did it affect your approach to the role?
Secretary DeVos: It confirmed my belief that entrenched interests were going to do their best to protect the status quo, their power, and their jobs no matter what. It gave me a clear-eyed look at the uphill battle I knew we would face as we pivoted the federal focus away from adults鈥� interests to what鈥檚 best for kids.
Rick: You came to your position as an outsider鈥攈ow has that mattered?
DeVos: Like I鈥檝e said before, I didn鈥檛 know all the things you 鈥渃an鈥檛 do.鈥� So I came in with fresh eyes and a laser focus on rethinking the way we approach all aspects of work at the department.
Rick: What surprised you most about the job?
DeVos: A couple of things. First, that the bureaucracy is even more bureaucratic than any of us could have ever imagined, and it takes longer to get anything done than I could have ever imagined. Second, seeing firsthand just how difficult it is for people in Washington to see beyond what is and imagine what could be. Third, and importantly, I am consistently inspired by what parents will do for their kids鈥� educations. I鈥檝e met single mothers driving Uber in addition to holding two other jobs just so their children can learn in schools that work for them. I鈥檝e met parents who didn鈥檛 wait for permission to home school their children nor did they wait for their schools to open this past spring, establishing their own learning pods and microschools so their children could continue learning. I suppose I鈥檓 not surprised by the ingenuity of America鈥檚 parents, but I am inspired by them and their students.
Rick: For you, what鈥檚 one anecdote that really captures what it鈥檚 like to be secretary of education?
DeVos: I remember talking with a group of young African American students in a school where they were benefiting from the Milwaukee voucher program and looking outside at a sea of middle-aged white protestors who apparently thought those students didn鈥檛 deserve that opportunity. I think that鈥檚 a pretty good microcosm of what my experience in office was like.
Rick: What was the most useful preparation you had to be secretary?
DeVos: I鈥檝e dedicated more than 30 years of my life to fighting for students, starting in my community, then throughout Michigan and in states across the country. I know what parents want and need for their children鈥檚 educations because I am one and because I鈥檝e fought alongside them to have the same choices and opportunities for their kids that I had for mine. People also forget this is ultimately a management job, not a teaching job. Among other things, you run one of the nation鈥檚 largest banks. Having actually led large organizations was very important preparation.
Rick: If you had to point to just one, what鈥檚 the single data point that really illuminates your thinking about American education?
DeVos: Half of lower-income 4th graders are below-basic readers, according to the most recent Nation鈥檚 Report Card. If the system is failing to teach the most basic of skills to the most vulnerable of students, how can anyone defend it? Worse yet, for the past quarter century, there has been no meaningful change in test scores, yet as taxpayers, we spend more and more for education each year. And by too many measures, these gaps are even widening. Perhaps the largest gap is between American students and their international peers. We鈥檙e not in the top 10鈥攊n anything. That鈥檚 not because our students aren鈥檛 capable; it鈥檚 because 鈥渢he system鈥� is culpable for failing them. And, if I could point to a couple more data points, there are currently millions of kids on charter school wait lists, and who say, if given the opportunity, they would choose a different school than their assigned one for their child. Parents are making clear what they think the solution is to the system鈥檚 failures.
Rick: What鈥檚 one thing that advocates and reformers should understand about federal education policy which they may not already?
DeVos: It needs your voices. Reformers rightly focus on the states, which are in control of education, but ignoring Washington comes with peril. Remember, a different president and secretary most certainly would have implemented the Every Student Succeeds Act in significantly more controlling ways.
Rick: What would you regard as your most significant accomplishment in office?
DeVos: Hands down, it鈥檚 changing the national conversation around what K-12 education can and should be. The concept of school choice is more popular across racial, ethnic, and political lines than ever before. I鈥檓 also proud of the team鈥檚 work on the historic Title IX rule which codified into law protections for all students.
Rick: And what would you say is your biggest regret?
DeVos: In four years, we set out to change the course set by the past 40 years of the department鈥檚 history. Though we鈥檝e made remarkable progress, as long as there are students stuck in schools that do not meet their needs, the work is not yet done. I believe that all children have unlimited potential and promise, and so every single one of them deserves the opportunity to find their educational fit. I regret that we didn鈥檛 push harder and earlier in the term.
Rick: Throughout your tenure, your emphasis has been on expanding educational choice for students and families. How would you evaluate your record on this score?
DeVos: My team and I have worked very hard to advance education freedom鈥攐r school choice, as most know it. This idea, which President Trump rightly calls 鈥渢he civil rights issue of our time,鈥� is on the march across the country. Students in more states have more opportunities to pursue the education that鈥檚 right for them today than when I first took office. Consider the bold expansions in North Carolina, Florida, West Virginia, Tennessee, and even in Illinois. Right here in D.C., participation in the school choice program is now 50 percent higher than it was four years ago, and there is still massive unmet demand. We鈥檝e changed the conversation at the federal level, too. Our proposal for Education Freedom Scholarships is the most ambitious in the nation鈥檚 history, and now there are more than 120 co-sponsors in Congress and more than 50 Senators who voted for Sen. McConnell鈥檚 COVID relief package who are helping us champion the idea.
Rick: You鈥檝e been a vocal champion of state and local control. What has struck you about the response to that call?
DeVos: I can鈥檛 say I鈥檓 surprised, but I am sorely disappointed that there wasn鈥檛 more support for state and local control. The very core of the Every Student Succeeds Act was about empowering states and fixing federal overreach. So many teachers just want control of their classrooms鈥攐n curriculum, on discipline, on helping students. And educators should remember that control was taken away from them by Washington when the Department of Education was created and even more drastically over the last two decades through programs like NCLB and Race to the Top. I restored as much local control as I can, but I suspect that鈥檚 going to be an uphill fight moving forward. There鈥檚 a regrettable tendency to want to federalize everything. I am optimistic, however, based on how Congress handled the CARES Act. We鈥檝e shown block grants to states make sense, and I hope that鈥檚 something people continue to look at and advance.
Rick: When it comes to COVID-19 and the pandemic that鈥檚 upended the nation and the world of education this year, what do you think schools have gotten right? What do you think they鈥檝e gotten wrong?
DeVos: The answer to that question depends on where the schools are located and on school leadership. I鈥檝e toured public, private, and parochial schools across the country that have safely reopened for in-person learning. Their leaders have can-do, get-it-done attitudes, and they put doing what鈥檚 best for students ahead of any other interests. At the same time, we鈥檝e seen some of America鈥檚 largest districts refuse to open, not based on the recommendation of scientists, but because of political interests.
Rick: What would you advise the new Congress and the next secretary of education to do next when it comes to COVID-19 and education?
DeVos: Where Congress is concerned, keep taking excuses off the table that are preventing kids from learning. The learning loss that is happening right now is a national tragedy that will have long-lasting and far-reaching consequences. We鈥檝e sent PPE, test kits, masks, and billions of dollars to schools already. I鈥檇 also remind Congress that students are who matter, and which building they go to school in shouldn鈥檛 matter when it comes to supporting them through the pandemic. As for my successor, I鈥檇 emphasize that parents today are more aware of what their children are鈥攐r are not鈥攍earning. And they鈥檙e more aware of who鈥檚 standing in the way. More than ever before, they are raising their voices for more options, for more choices, for freedom. The need for education freedom is especially acute for kids whose government-assigned schools are refusing to open鈥攁nd those families should be able to take their education dollars to schools that will.
Rick: More broadly, what鈥檚 the most important piece of advice you鈥檇 give your successor?
DeVos: There鈥檚 one simple guiding principle I鈥檇 urge not just the next education secretary to embrace, but any educator and education leader: Put students first. When doing what鈥檚 right for individual students is your number-one priority, everything else becomes much clearer.
Rick: Last question. Looking ahead, what鈥檚 next for you?
DeVos: I haven鈥檛 focused much on that yet, but it鈥檚 safe to say I鈥檒l be very much in the fight for students. For so many families, the pandemic has laid bare the flaws in the education system, and so many students have been harmed as a result. The timing and need for big reforms have never been greater.
This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity. AEI has received funding from DeVos family foundations.
